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Thursday, 29 November 2012 01:30
Nobody asked me, but . . .
* Now that Ben Roethlisberger is practicing on a limited basis his availability for the game Sunday at Baltimore will be a much-discussed subject this week. Really, though, it’s simple: If the doctors say he can play, he should play.
* It’s probably not going to happen, but if the Pirates sign free-agent catcher Russell Martin, it would be an upgrade at a position of much need. How can anyone complain about that? It is absolutely priceless that people complain when the Pirates don’t spend and they complain when they do spend.
* Based on the surprising performance of the Indianapolis Colts, 7-4 after being 2-14 last year, Bruce Arians should be a legitimate candidate for NFL coach of the year.
* In terms of football and basketball -- if not number of TV sets -- Louisville brings more to the ACC than did Maryland, the team it will replace. With the $50 million exit fee apparently no deterrent to Maryland, will the ACC make the fee even higher?
* Judging from sales, it looks like ticket buyers remember the Pirates June-July run more than their August-September collapse. Concerning season-ticket sales, team president Frank Coonelly told the Tribune Review: ``We are pacing significantly ahead of last year’s pace, which was significantly above the previous year’s pace.’’
* NFL power rankings (for what their worth): ESPN has the Steelers 14th and the Cincinnati Bengals 11th. Peter King at SI.com also has Cincinnati 11th in his top 15. The Steelers didn’t make it.
* Lots of criticism of Pitt quarterback Tino Sunseri for his lack of fourth-quarter heroics. Isn’t Ray Graham the team’s best offensive player? Why isn’t he getting some of the same criticism?
* How’s this for an ugly omen. Since 1999, when the Cleveland NFL franchise was renewed, the Steelers have never made the playoffs in a year they lost to the Browns. That would be 1999, 2000, 2003 and 2009.
* Atlanta signed free-agent outfielder B.J. Upton to a five-year, $75 million contract yesterday. His OPS each of the past four seasons beginning in 2009: .686, .747, .760, .752. Garrett Jones’ OPS over the same years: .939, .720, .754 .833.
* The Pitt football team scored 17 points in September against Youngstown State, a team that during a four-week, mid-season span gave up 48 points to North Dakota State, 35 to Illinois State, 38 to Southern Illinois and 41 to South Dakota State.
* The NFL cities with the best television rating average in 2012: New Orleans 47.4; Green Bay 46.4; Pittsburgh 44.8; Denver 37.3; Boston 36.0; Baltimore 35.0.
* The deadline for offering contracts to arbitration-eligible players is tomorrow. Among the Pirates eligible, Jeff Karstens and Charlie Morton are the two with the greatest chance of being non-tendered. Others have mentioned Gaby Sanchez, but the Pirates gave up too much to get him to cast him aside.
* Pitt center Steven Adams is yet another highly touted freshman who has been disappointing thus far. Coach Jamie Dixon should continue to play Adams with the good chance that he’ll gain some confidence in the upcoming juggernaut of a schedule facing the Panthers -- Detroit, Duquesne, North Florida, Bethune-Cookman, Delaware State and Kennesaw State.
* The Pirates yesterday traded for three players almost no one had heard of -- pitchers Zach Stewart and Vin Mazzaro and first baseman Clint Robinson -- and immediately there was the expected bellowing about ‘dumpster diving.’ For starters, such a means of player procurement is perfectly acceptable, with Garrett Jones being the prime example. Additionally, as this story relates, the players have varying degrees of upside and the Pirates gave up next to nothing to obtain them.
Comments (84)
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written by DaveK, November 29, 2012 - 12:33 AM
written by DaveK, November 29, 2012 - 12:33 AM
As per Pitt basketball-that typically weak schedule does nothing for that team. And that is a fact, but Jamie dixon continues to do the same moronic thing and schedule teams that do nothing to help develope his own team. Aside fro Duquesne which is a local rival, the continuous scheduling of the cream puffs does more harm than good.
cut your teeth on some quality competition. Thats how teams ge better. Come February and March these games agains Howatd and North Florida are going to hurt you not help you.
-hope we sign Martin
-hope Bens plays IF healthy enough
-the offense Pitt runs in basketball is making it hard for Adams top have an impact. He has to be more involved than setting screens.
cut your teeth on some quality competition. Thats how teams ge better. Come February and March these games agains Howatd and North Florida are going to hurt you not help you.
-hope we sign Martin
-hope Bens plays IF healthy enough
-the offense Pitt runs in basketball is making it hard for Adams top have an impact. He has to be more involved than setting screens.
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written by apm74, November 29, 2012 - 01:24 AM
written by apm74, November 29, 2012 - 01:24 AM
Suggesting that Steven Adams is thus far, a disappointment is entirely premature. He's not Michael Beasley or Carmelo Anthony, nor is it realistic to expect that of him. Out of every recruiting class you might have two or three immediate superstars. Almost everyone else among the "highly touted" are projects, touted highly based on potential. Adams has shown a high motor and good rebounding instincts at times this year. I think one can be optimistic about his future.
What Pitt fans should also do is temper their expectations about where Adams could take the team. It's true a team needs a dominant front line to go far in the NCAA's. But center-dominated teams rarely do so. Basketball is a guard-oriented sport. And until Pitt gets a guard who can create his own scoring opportunities and make shots consistently, it will struggle to win consecutive games in the NCAA's. Right now, there is no one on the roster who can do that. As a center, that is not Adams' role, nor will it be his fault when Pitt struggles to score in certain stretches as they did against Michigan.
Adding muscle will make Adams a much better player. Give him time.
What Pitt fans should also do is temper their expectations about where Adams could take the team. It's true a team needs a dominant front line to go far in the NCAA's. But center-dominated teams rarely do so. Basketball is a guard-oriented sport. And until Pitt gets a guard who can create his own scoring opportunities and make shots consistently, it will struggle to win consecutive games in the NCAA's. Right now, there is no one on the roster who can do that. As a center, that is not Adams' role, nor will it be his fault when Pitt struggles to score in certain stretches as they did against Michigan.
Adding muscle will make Adams a much better player. Give him time.
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written by DaveK, November 29, 2012 - 01:57 AM
written by DaveK, November 29, 2012 - 01:57 AM
Adams is a disappointment thus far. That is reality. Being a Pitt apologist doesn't chane that. You can put quotes around it all you want. He was highly touted. And he hasn't lived up to expectations yet. Period. Its not saying he never will, but its just as likely (probably way more) he won't than it is he will.
Sugar coating it doesn;t make it different than what it really is, unless you have one heck of an imagination.
and that sissified schedule is still not going to help them. They might as well scrimmage themselves.
Sugar coating it doesn;t make it different than what it really is, unless you have one heck of an imagination.
and that sissified schedule is still not going to help them. They might as well scrimmage themselves.
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written by BiC, November 29, 2012 - 02:58 AM
written by BiC, November 29, 2012 - 02:58 AM
* Roethlisberger absolutely should play unless the issue with his rib and shoulder can be made worse with another hit. If it can -- then forget it. This team isn't a Super Bowl contender this year -- so they're better off shutting down for a better draft pick.
* Whoop de do about Arians. Means as much to me as what Whisenhunt and Grimm are up to -- although those guys didn't hurt the Steelers the way the SuperGenius did. Wish he was the Colts coach of year a few years ago. Maybe the Steelers would've beaten Green Bay then.
* Well, I'm going to question the Pirates spending $25M of their limited resources on a catcher who hit .211 last year -- the sixth year in a row his batting average declined. While that might be an upgrade over the jokers behind the plate last year -- the last thing the Pirates need is yet another easy out in situations when runs need to be batted in.
A.J. Pierzynski's available. Played a couple of more games last year. Hit .278. Higher OBP. More home runs. Nearly 50% more RBIs. Made $6M vs. Martin's $7.5M, too. So what if he's a few years older? It's not like either guy's going to stick around after 2 or 3 years, anyway. While he's not as highly rated defensively -- it's not like he's as incompetent as Barajas was by any stretch of the imagination.
I'm definitely no baseball guru -- but the Pirates were 23rd in runs scored and 12th in runs given up last year -- and that's with McCutchen having a heck of a run for a big, big chunk of the season.
Leave it to the Pirates to ignore the former and bolster the latter. If they want to spend money for the sake of spending money, I could care less. Let them boost payroll and keep losing. Nutting might bail sooner that way.
* Whoop de do about Arians. Means as much to me as what Whisenhunt and Grimm are up to -- although those guys didn't hurt the Steelers the way the SuperGenius did. Wish he was the Colts coach of year a few years ago. Maybe the Steelers would've beaten Green Bay then.
* Well, I'm going to question the Pirates spending $25M of their limited resources on a catcher who hit .211 last year -- the sixth year in a row his batting average declined. While that might be an upgrade over the jokers behind the plate last year -- the last thing the Pirates need is yet another easy out in situations when runs need to be batted in.
A.J. Pierzynski's available. Played a couple of more games last year. Hit .278. Higher OBP. More home runs. Nearly 50% more RBIs. Made $6M vs. Martin's $7.5M, too. So what if he's a few years older? It's not like either guy's going to stick around after 2 or 3 years, anyway. While he's not as highly rated defensively -- it's not like he's as incompetent as Barajas was by any stretch of the imagination.
I'm definitely no baseball guru -- but the Pirates were 23rd in runs scored and 12th in runs given up last year -- and that's with McCutchen having a heck of a run for a big, big chunk of the season.
Leave it to the Pirates to ignore the former and bolster the latter. If they want to spend money for the sake of spending money, I could care less. Let them boost payroll and keep losing. Nutting might bail sooner that way.
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written by dontknocktherock, November 29, 2012 - 04:20 AM
written by dontknocktherock, November 29, 2012 - 04:20 AM
Looking at the 162 game averages for Pierzynski and Martin on baseballreference.com, they are remarkably similar for HR, RBI, and OPS. If Martin is better defensively and at least somebody in MLB likes him (not the case with Pierzynski) and he is six years younger, I believe he's he better choice of the two.
Tony Sanchez my indeed be in track to become a decent major league catcher, but doing so in 2013 has little chance of happening. Sign Martin even for $20M/3 and it may be money well spent. If Sanchez develops having both would be a good problem to have.
Tony Sanchez my indeed be in track to become a decent major league catcher, but doing so in 2013 has little chance of happening. Sign Martin even for $20M/3 and it may be money well spent. If Sanchez develops having both would be a good problem to have.
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written by Pasquinelli, November 29, 2012 - 04:37 AM
written by Pasquinelli, November 29, 2012 - 04:37 AM
Even if the doctors say Ben is ready, I can't see how an injury like that could be healed. We saw what happened in SF last year. If Ben plays against the Ratbirds, they'll see to it that he's carted off on a stretcher--or in a hearse.
I really like the idea of going after Martin. He should be entering his prime. I attrbute the low BA to the Yankee "swing for the fences" effect. And the fact of the matter is that the Bucs are going to have to overpay to attract that first, legitimate FA. I can't believe I'm saying this, but in the scheme of things 25 Mil, isn't that much for a baseball team to spend.
I really like the idea of going after Martin. He should be entering his prime. I attrbute the low BA to the Yankee "swing for the fences" effect. And the fact of the matter is that the Bucs are going to have to overpay to attract that first, legitimate FA. I can't believe I'm saying this, but in the scheme of things 25 Mil, isn't that much for a baseball team to spend.
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written by Woomer, November 29, 2012 - 05:30 AM
Because I don't think he's likely to be an "upgrade".
The year before the Pirates signed Rod Barajas, he batted: .230/.287/.430/.717 with 16 HR.
Last year Russell Martin batted: .211/.311/.403/.713 with 21 HR.
Very similar numbers...AND Martin has been on a steady decline for the past 5 years.
So....what makes you think that Martin will not follow the same progression as Barajas did, if he joins the team next season?
An egregious case of cherrypicking your stats. -- Bob Smizik
written by Woomer, November 29, 2012 - 05:30 AM
It’s probably not going to happen, but if the Pirates sign free-agent catcher Russell Martin, it would be an upgrade at a position of much need. How can anyone complain about that?
Because I don't think he's likely to be an "upgrade".
The year before the Pirates signed Rod Barajas, he batted: .230/.287/.430/.717 with 16 HR.
Last year Russell Martin batted: .211/.311/.403/.713 with 21 HR.
Very similar numbers...AND Martin has been on a steady decline for the past 5 years.
So....what makes you think that Martin will not follow the same progression as Barajas did, if he joins the team next season?
An egregious case of cherrypicking your stats. -- Bob Smizik
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written by lambert58, November 29, 2012 - 05:37 AM
written by lambert58, November 29, 2012 - 05:37 AM
After watching Ben in the San Francisco game last year, I don`t know what doctors mean when they say he [or any player] "can play". Does it mean he can walk? To me, it`s "how effective can he be?"
As always, I`m amused by the amount of butthurt our so-called fans still manufacture when the name "Arians" is mentioned. First, blaming him for not winning more Super Bowls was and is ridiculous. His offense scored 25 against Green Bay despite three turnovers. Two of the TOs were horrible picks thrown by Ben. One was returned for a TD. The D could not stop Rodgers. That`s why we lost. In fairness, nobody could stop Rodgers that year.
Maybe a lot of fans are embarrassed because after their constant proclamations that "no other team would ever hire this bum", he got another OC job within a week after Artie Rooney said he had "retired". Artie, you fibber. I guess Chuck Pagano and the Colts are a bunch of dummies, huh?
I don`t much care about the Colts but it`s silly to fly off the handle just because Bob or anyone else says that Arians is doing a good job with them this year. He is 6-2 as interim head coach, with a rookie QB and a weak supporting cast. The Colts are 7-4 and in line for a playoff spot. Festering hate will only destroy the haters, not Arians. He seems quite happy.
As always, I`m amused by the amount of butthurt our so-called fans still manufacture when the name "Arians" is mentioned. First, blaming him for not winning more Super Bowls was and is ridiculous. His offense scored 25 against Green Bay despite three turnovers. Two of the TOs were horrible picks thrown by Ben. One was returned for a TD. The D could not stop Rodgers. That`s why we lost. In fairness, nobody could stop Rodgers that year.
Maybe a lot of fans are embarrassed because after their constant proclamations that "no other team would ever hire this bum", he got another OC job within a week after Artie Rooney said he had "retired". Artie, you fibber. I guess Chuck Pagano and the Colts are a bunch of dummies, huh?
I don`t much care about the Colts but it`s silly to fly off the handle just because Bob or anyone else says that Arians is doing a good job with them this year. He is 6-2 as interim head coach, with a rookie QB and a weak supporting cast. The Colts are 7-4 and in line for a playoff spot. Festering hate will only destroy the haters, not Arians. He seems quite happy.
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written by Singollo, November 29, 2012 - 05:39 AM
Great point, Bob. If they do get Martin at 3 years, for $25MM, so what? So they overpaid? Who cares? If they sign him it will mean that, as you say, they significantly upgraded a position of need.
I'm still not sold on Russell vs. AJ, but either is better than starting wih McKenry and hoping Tony Sanchez can play MLB ball in June or July.
Honestly, I can't comprehend why anyone would have a problem with this. It's not long-term, it doesn't hamstring the franchise financially, and it doesn't take away from the ability to lock-up other young players in the system, should they prove deserving.
What is the risk/downside? That Martin is a complete bust? Martin could have an awful year and still give the team better performance at the cacther position than they'd likely have recieved otherwise.
There aren't (to my knoweledge) any superior free agents available that in the Pirate's league at all, so you aren't taking money away from a better signing.
If the only possible downside to a deal is that maybe the Pirates are a little less profitable next year, that I can certainly live with.
In all honesty, these are EXACTLY the type of FA signings the team should be making each year. I don't expect them to compete for top-level FAs, but the mid-tier guys who can be had for 2-4 years, between 20-30MM (basically the going rate for a proven MLB veteran) ... they HAVE to be players in that market each year.
written by Singollo, November 29, 2012 - 05:39 AM
Bob Smizik: ...if the Pirates sign free-agent catcher Russell Martin, it would be an upgrade at a position of much need. How can anyone complain about that?
Great point, Bob. If they do get Martin at 3 years, for $25MM, so what? So they overpaid? Who cares? If they sign him it will mean that, as you say, they significantly upgraded a position of need.
I'm still not sold on Russell vs. AJ, but either is better than starting wih McKenry and hoping Tony Sanchez can play MLB ball in June or July.
Honestly, I can't comprehend why anyone would have a problem with this. It's not long-term, it doesn't hamstring the franchise financially, and it doesn't take away from the ability to lock-up other young players in the system, should they prove deserving.
What is the risk/downside? That Martin is a complete bust? Martin could have an awful year and still give the team better performance at the cacther position than they'd likely have recieved otherwise.
There aren't (to my knoweledge) any superior free agents available that in the Pirate's league at all, so you aren't taking money away from a better signing.
If the only possible downside to a deal is that maybe the Pirates are a little less profitable next year, that I can certainly live with.
In all honesty, these are EXACTLY the type of FA signings the team should be making each year. I don't expect them to compete for top-level FAs, but the mid-tier guys who can be had for 2-4 years, between 20-30MM (basically the going rate for a proven MLB veteran) ... they HAVE to be players in that market each year.
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written by Amarillo_Fats, November 29, 2012 - 05:42 AM
written by Amarillo_Fats, November 29, 2012 - 05:42 AM
Agree 100% with Woomer's 06:30 AM post. I do criticize the Pirates for not spending enough. And I also criticize them for spending stupidly. Are they simply trying to corner the market on .200 hitting catchers? I hear Bob Uecker is available; probably for less than $8M per.
And, I thought it humorous that they made a trade for Clint Robinson. I advocated trading for Robinson at the 2011 trading deadline. He was hitting the cover off the ball in AAA that year, after having done the same thing in AA in 2010. Then last year, his power dropped off, his average declined 30 points, and the Pirates made the move!
http://www.milb.com/milb/stats...pid=519208
Eh, well...that's why they're the Bucs. 20 year streaks don't happen by accident.
Barajas was the second-best catcher available in free agency last year. He did not work out but I cannot fault the Pirates for signing him at barely more than the MLB average. -- Bob Smizik
And, I thought it humorous that they made a trade for Clint Robinson. I advocated trading for Robinson at the 2011 trading deadline. He was hitting the cover off the ball in AAA that year, after having done the same thing in AA in 2010. Then last year, his power dropped off, his average declined 30 points, and the Pirates made the move!
http://www.milb.com/milb/stats...pid=519208
Eh, well...that's why they're the Bucs. 20 year streaks don't happen by accident.
Barajas was the second-best catcher available in free agency last year. He did not work out but I cannot fault the Pirates for signing him at barely more than the MLB average. -- Bob Smizik
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written by BarelySane, November 29, 2012 - 05:49 AM
Aaron Gray wasn't great when he arrived. He wasn't that bad when he left.
written by BarelySane, November 29, 2012 - 05:49 AM
Pitt center Steven Adams is yet another highly touted freshman who has been disappointing thus far.
Aaron Gray wasn't great when he arrived. He wasn't that bad when he left.
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written by heartbeatsings, November 29, 2012 - 05:57 AM
The guy on the North Shore Connector actually did ask me:
--I don't play Ben this week, regardless of what the Doctors say.
--Unless there is some hidden connection to Pittsburgh that I'm not aware of, there no way Martin signs with the Pirates.
--The Pirates DFA'd the best pure hitter and defensive first baseman in their system yesterday. No, 20 straight years of losing isn't a fluke.
--How many of Wanny's players are left at Pitt? Given the state of signings and retention after he "resigned", the next couple of years could be very bleak. I don't think Russell Shell can play all 22 positions simultaneously.
--Does Martin speak spanish? I thought that was a prerequisite. How will he tell Wandy to quit prissing around and throw strikes? Will he use the itranslate app on his iphone? I don't think the Pirates will pay for that.
--As a Duke's fan, I miss TJ McConnell
--You always have to parse Coonelly's words very carefully. When everything was said and done, I don't think the Pirates sold more Full Season equivalent season tickets last year and I don't think they will this year. A "season ticket" can be as little as a six game package.
--UConn would have brought significantly more TV sets to the ACC than Louisville. I guess the BC blockade is still intact.
--Will either Jose Tabata or Travis Snider be the player to be named later in the Red Sox deal?
--Make no mistake, the Steelers miss Hines Ward in the locker room, in the film room and on the field. Ryan Clark has stepped up on defense to fill the void left by losing James Farrior, but no one has emerged on offense to take Ward's place.
written by heartbeatsings, November 29, 2012 - 05:57 AM
The guy on the North Shore Connector actually did ask me:
--I don't play Ben this week, regardless of what the Doctors say.
--Unless there is some hidden connection to Pittsburgh that I'm not aware of, there no way Martin signs with the Pirates.
--The Pirates DFA'd the best pure hitter and defensive first baseman in their system yesterday. No, 20 straight years of losing isn't a fluke.
--How many of Wanny's players are left at Pitt? Given the state of signings and retention after he "resigned", the next couple of years could be very bleak. I don't think Russell Shell can play all 22 positions simultaneously.
--Does Martin speak spanish? I thought that was a prerequisite. How will he tell Wandy to quit prissing around and throw strikes? Will he use the itranslate app on his iphone? I don't think the Pirates will pay for that.
--As a Duke's fan, I miss TJ McConnell
--You always have to parse Coonelly's words very carefully. When everything was said and done, I don't think the Pirates sold more Full Season equivalent season tickets last year and I don't think they will this year. A "season ticket" can be as little as a six game package.
--UConn would have brought significantly more TV sets to the ACC than Louisville. I guess the BC blockade is still intact.
--Will either Jose Tabata or Travis Snider be the player to be named later in the Red Sox deal?
--Make no mistake, the Steelers miss Hines Ward in the locker room, in the film room and on the field. Ryan Clark has stepped up on defense to fill the void left by losing James Farrior, but no one has emerged on offense to take Ward's place.
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written by the earl of balmoral, November 29, 2012 - 06:00 AM
The challenge facing the ACC is not raising the exit fee but working to insure schools don't want to leave.
That might mean exsisting members sacrifice current revenue to attract bigger fish and larger future TV revenue rather raiding what is left of the Big East.
written by the earl of balmoral, November 29, 2012 - 06:00 AM
The challenge facing the ACC is not raising the exit fee but working to insure schools don't want to leave.
That might mean exsisting members sacrifice current revenue to attract bigger fish and larger future TV revenue rather raiding what is left of the Big East.
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written by bobbyg16148, November 29, 2012 - 06:06 AM
written by bobbyg16148, November 29, 2012 - 06:06 AM
Bruce Arians is't officially the head coach, so not sure if an interim head coach can win the award?
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written by Darkhorses, November 29, 2012 - 06:14 AM
written by Darkhorses, November 29, 2012 - 06:14 AM
I don't mind the Pirates spending money. I usually don't like who they waste their money on. Have to admit the track record is poor
Hope the doctors aren't biased to the front office of the Steelers. Worse I hope their not the doctors who originally handled Syd
Upton for 15 million a year? yikes
Since when is Gorkys Hernandez too much to give up?
Also gave up a high draft choice. -- Bob Smizik
Hope the doctors aren't biased to the front office of the Steelers. Worse I hope their not the doctors who originally handled Syd
Upton for 15 million a year? yikes
Since when is Gorkys Hernandez too much to give up?
Also gave up a high draft choice. -- Bob Smizik
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written by 123, November 29, 2012 - 06:14 AM
written by 123, November 29, 2012 - 06:14 AM
The Steelers 44.8% and the Pens lead US teams with, what, 8.0? Makes me laugh when people say sometimes that hockey is catching up to football here. Never. Not even close.
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written by heartbeatsings, November 29, 2012 - 06:17 AM
If Bob's point is that Jones is going to get a very nice bump in his salary this year, I think he is right. Will it be with the Pirates, though?
Upton showed a nice steady improvement over the course of his time in Tampa. Jones took a drastic leap forward last year, which has to be considered suspicious. Which, frankly, isnt a problem unless he get's caught.
written by heartbeatsings, November 29, 2012 - 06:17 AM
If Bob's point is that Jones is going to get a very nice bump in his salary this year, I think he is right. Will it be with the Pirates, though?
Upton showed a nice steady improvement over the course of his time in Tampa. Jones took a drastic leap forward last year, which has to be considered suspicious. Which, frankly, isnt a problem unless he get's caught.
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written by One Simple Post, November 29, 2012 - 06:22 AM
written by One Simple Post, November 29, 2012 - 06:22 AM
The only award Bruce Arians should be considered for is the "Most Fortunate To Have Andrew Luck" award.
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written by csf, November 29, 2012 - 06:29 AM
written by csf, November 29, 2012 - 06:29 AM
There are only 2 ways that Univ of Maryland, which has recently dropped a large handful of sports, will pay off the $50M exit fee:
- the UnderArmour owner who is an alum will help out, or more likely
- it will be an installment loan from the B10
FSU will not get such help as the SEC already has a footprint in Northern FL and the FL Panhandle. And not sure the B12 would be willing to pny up either.
Va Tech would be a bigger prize for the SEC, however it seems to be satisfied in the ACC ... plus it was less than a decade ago that VA legislators forced the ACC hand in accepting the Hokies ... when they were not one of the original 3 being pegged for the ACC.
Of course, these days, you never know what will happen ... but don't scoff at the $50M exit fee
- the UnderArmour owner who is an alum will help out, or more likely
- it will be an installment loan from the B10
FSU will not get such help as the SEC already has a footprint in Northern FL and the FL Panhandle. And not sure the B12 would be willing to pny up either.
Va Tech would be a bigger prize for the SEC, however it seems to be satisfied in the ACC ... plus it was less than a decade ago that VA legislators forced the ACC hand in accepting the Hokies ... when they were not one of the original 3 being pegged for the ACC.
Of course, these days, you never know what will happen ... but don't scoff at the $50M exit fee
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written by Darkhorses, November 29, 2012 - 06:30 AM
written by Darkhorses, November 29, 2012 - 06:30 AM
"Wish he was the Colts coach of year a few years ago. Maybe the Steelers would've beaten Green Bay then.'
If Mendenhall was the number 3 back, we may have beaten GB.
If Mendenhall was the number 3 back, we may have beaten GB.
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written by BFD, November 29, 2012 - 06:31 AM
written by BFD, November 29, 2012 - 06:31 AM
"It is absolutely priceless that people complain when the Pirates don’t spend and they complain when they do spend. "-BOB S.
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first, i am all for upgrading any position so long as it is being upgraded to AT LEAST an avg. MLB caliber player
2nd- some take issue with "spending money" on a player such as this ONLY because signing him to 8 million means they will reduce salarly elsewhere by 8 million. THEY ARE NOT ADDING 8 MIL. TO PAYROLL
So are we to believe liar Frank when he says ticket sales are "pacing significantly higher? WHY? And if they are higher, same on the lemmings purchasing the county fair tickets.
And i see Bob has fallen for the "upside" bologna regarding the lattest dumpster dives of Zach Stewart and Vin Mazzaro
Yes.... Other teams look through the scrap heap looking for a diamond in the rough. The Pirates count on the scrapheap as their major
Gets in the offseason.
More of the same. XXI - put it in the books.
I've fallen for nothing involving those players. You get what you pay for. My only point was there's no reason to be jumping all over the Pirates for a minor deal. -- Bob Smizik
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first, i am all for upgrading any position so long as it is being upgraded to AT LEAST an avg. MLB caliber player
2nd- some take issue with "spending money" on a player such as this ONLY because signing him to 8 million means they will reduce salarly elsewhere by 8 million. THEY ARE NOT ADDING 8 MIL. TO PAYROLL
So are we to believe liar Frank when he says ticket sales are "pacing significantly higher? WHY? And if they are higher, same on the lemmings purchasing the county fair tickets.
And i see Bob has fallen for the "upside" bologna regarding the lattest dumpster dives of Zach Stewart and Vin Mazzaro
Yes.... Other teams look through the scrap heap looking for a diamond in the rough. The Pirates count on the scrapheap as their major
Gets in the offseason.
More of the same. XXI - put it in the books.
I've fallen for nothing involving those players. You get what you pay for. My only point was there's no reason to be jumping all over the Pirates for a minor deal. -- Bob Smizik
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written by CliveJameson, November 29, 2012 - 06:31 AM
I think it comes from listening to the Pirates cry "poor" for years. We all remember the Matt Morris trade. It is clear that the much ballyhooed plan isn't working as well as had been hoped for.
Plus, people like to complain!
written by CliveJameson, November 29, 2012 - 06:31 AM
It’s probably not going to happen, but if the Pirates sign free-agent catcher Russell Martin, it would be an upgrade at a position of much need. How can anyone complain about that? It is absolutely priceless that people complain when the Pirates don’t spend and they complain when they do spend.
I think it comes from listening to the Pirates cry "poor" for years. We all remember the Matt Morris trade. It is clear that the much ballyhooed plan isn't working as well as had been hoped for.
Plus, people like to complain!
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written by Poppopts, November 29, 2012 - 06:31 AM
written by Poppopts, November 29, 2012 - 06:31 AM
With a make-shift offensive line, you are going to get Ben killed and lost for the season. Nothing would please the Rattens more. Don't think that they don't think about having to play a "healthy" Steelers team in the playoffs.
They're not going to win the division, so this game means nothing. Win out (which should be easier given that 3 of the 4 games are at home), and they'll make the playoffs as a wild card. Then, look out, Rattens.
Give him, Colon,and others another week to get completely healthy.
They're not going to win the division, so this game means nothing. Win out (which should be easier given that 3 of the 4 games are at home), and they'll make the playoffs as a wild card. Then, look out, Rattens.
Give him, Colon,and others another week to get completely healthy.
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written by Lauraswife, November 29, 2012 - 06:36 AM
What on earth are you talking about? When this topic was first discussed yesterday, I didn't hear anyone complaining about the Pirates spending money on Martin, just the fact they couldn't and/or wouldn't.
Just because a few thrift store shoppers here like to think everything including quality ball players can be bought cheaply and with a coupon, doesn't mean even those tight-fisted believers of "The Plan" would have a problem with the Pirates spending money on a quality asset either. In fact, they would be the first ones to turn around and say: "See, we told you they weren't cheapskates."
Anyway...Martin signing with the Pirates isn't happening so let's just drop it already.
written by Lauraswife, November 29, 2012 - 06:36 AM
It’s probably not going to happen, but if the Pirates sign free-agent catcher Russell Martin, it would be an upgrade at a position of much need. How can anyone complain about that? It is absolutely priceless that people complain when the Pirates don’t spend and they complain when they do spend.
What on earth are you talking about? When this topic was first discussed yesterday, I didn't hear anyone complaining about the Pirates spending money on Martin, just the fact they couldn't and/or wouldn't.
Just because a few thrift store shoppers here like to think everything including quality ball players can be bought cheaply and with a coupon, doesn't mean even those tight-fisted believers of "The Plan" would have a problem with the Pirates spending money on a quality asset either. In fact, they would be the first ones to turn around and say: "See, we told you they weren't cheapskates."
Anyway...Martin signing with the Pirates isn't happening so let's just drop it already.
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written by csf, November 29, 2012 - 06:40 AM
written by csf, November 29, 2012 - 06:40 AM
of all the prize prospects that Jamie Dixon has brought in, Adams by far is the most raw and unpolished but has the biggest upside.
I have little doubt that you will see a vast improvement within the next 2 years.
I have little doubt that you will see a vast improvement within the next 2 years.
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written by griffirs, November 29, 2012 - 06:46 AM
written by griffirs, November 29, 2012 - 06:46 AM
Stewart and Mazzaro look like a couple of warm bodies to sit in Karstens and Correia's seats next year. TMTIB will market them as an upgrade;they're really a downgrade who will be used to justify saving 9-10 million in payroll costs. Team would be better on the field if they kept Karstens for another year.
Robinson could be an interesting addition to the offense. A left hand hitting first baseman with some pop-Robinson could platoon with Sanchez at first, freeing Jones to return to a corner outfield slot-and keeping Elvis Presley and Tabata on the bench where they belong, given their lack of offensive production from corner outfield slots.
Robinson could be an interesting addition to the offense. A left hand hitting first baseman with some pop-Robinson could platoon with Sanchez at first, freeing Jones to return to a corner outfield slot-and keeping Elvis Presley and Tabata on the bench where they belong, given their lack of offensive production from corner outfield slots.
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written by BUCCS72, November 29, 2012 - 06:51 AM
written by BUCCS72, November 29, 2012 - 06:51 AM
Some "nobody ever wants to ask" opinions on the topics...
---Not sure what the Steelers have to gain playing Rothlisberger this week...IMO....IF he is near 100%...a HUGE IF...how much does he increase their chances of beating the Ravens in Baltimore? Not enough...IMO...to warrant risking another injury to their only chance of salvaging a playoff spot past this week. I would show mercy on Batch as well and play Brian Hoyer....limp out of Baltimore with the 6-6 record and then focus on winning the last four games with, hopefully, as healthy a Rothisberger as possible.
---I agree that what happened in SF last season should be a lesson learned....Rothlisberger was declared "healthy enough to play" for that game too. Did he look healthy enough to play? And we will never know how much the ankle injury was aggravated in that game and the practices leading up to it...and how that contributed to him remaining hobbled right through their loss in Denver. Keep Rothlisberger sitting this week.
---I want the Pirates to spend more money on their payroll....but they have to do it wisely and I just don't think Russell Martin represents that...besides...following their second consecutive history-making collapse, do you really think it will make a difference? This team is headed nowhere except to Numero XXI.
---Yeah...the deals made yesterday by the Pirates were just more dumpster dives....but that's OK....all teams do some of that....the sad fact is that those deals will probably be their biggest "splash" roster "improvements" this offseason other than non-tendering Karstens and jettisoning Hanrahan.
What a pathetic franchise! Hoka Hey!
---Not sure what the Steelers have to gain playing Rothlisberger this week...IMO....IF he is near 100%...a HUGE IF...how much does he increase their chances of beating the Ravens in Baltimore? Not enough...IMO...to warrant risking another injury to their only chance of salvaging a playoff spot past this week. I would show mercy on Batch as well and play Brian Hoyer....limp out of Baltimore with the 6-6 record and then focus on winning the last four games with, hopefully, as healthy a Rothisberger as possible.
---I agree that what happened in SF last season should be a lesson learned....Rothlisberger was declared "healthy enough to play" for that game too. Did he look healthy enough to play? And we will never know how much the ankle injury was aggravated in that game and the practices leading up to it...and how that contributed to him remaining hobbled right through their loss in Denver. Keep Rothlisberger sitting this week.
---I want the Pirates to spend more money on their payroll....but they have to do it wisely and I just don't think Russell Martin represents that...besides...following their second consecutive history-making collapse, do you really think it will make a difference? This team is headed nowhere except to Numero XXI.
---Yeah...the deals made yesterday by the Pirates were just more dumpster dives....but that's OK....all teams do some of that....the sad fact is that those deals will probably be their biggest "splash" roster "improvements" this offseason other than non-tendering Karstens and jettisoning Hanrahan.
What a pathetic franchise! Hoka Hey!
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written by sonic, November 29, 2012 - 07:01 AM
written by sonic, November 29, 2012 - 07:01 AM
I don't think anyone is complaining about the Pirates spending or not spending money. It is HOW they are spending it. 25 million/3 years on a guy who's batting average is trending downward the last few years...hitting .211 last year.
I'll bet if Barajas played every game last year he may have hit 21 HR's as well and his average would be under .200.
Bucs never seem to acquire anyone who is actually IN or actually approaching their prime...that is the complaint.
What little money they actually do spend, is spent questionably.
I'll bet if Barajas played every game last year he may have hit 21 HR's as well and his average would be under .200.
Bucs never seem to acquire anyone who is actually IN or actually approaching their prime...that is the complaint.
What little money they actually do spend, is spent questionably.
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written by ronshanklin, November 29, 2012 - 07:04 AM
written by ronshanklin, November 29, 2012 - 07:04 AM
Excellent points Bob.
1-Absolutely Ben should play if the doctors say he's good to go. and not in a limited capacity either.
2-We complain when the Bucs spend money for the wrong reasons and/or the wrong players, which seems to be 90% of the time.
3-What a kick in the pants for us if Arians gets Coach of the Year. They're 22nd in the league in both points scored and points allowed, and his their pass vs run ratio is about the same as when he was with the Steelers-60/40.
4-Who cares?
5-How do we know Coonley isn't lying? He's the one that said Freddy Sanchez was the next Ted Williams.
6-Sounds about right.
7-See #4.
8-Don't need an omen to know we are not going to make the playoffs. Too many injuries, RB by committee that failed, etc.
9-Thank goodness Jones already lost his arbitration...whew!
10-See #'s 4 & 7.
11-No surprise there.
12-Shame if you're right about Karstens. Always liked his coolness under pressure. Never know which Charlie Morton is goiong to show up. And Sanchez, well, another dumpster diving product we're stuck with. Best management team in sports, eh?
13 & 14-Again, who cares.
1-Absolutely Ben should play if the doctors say he's good to go. and not in a limited capacity either.
2-We complain when the Bucs spend money for the wrong reasons and/or the wrong players, which seems to be 90% of the time.
3-What a kick in the pants for us if Arians gets Coach of the Year. They're 22nd in the league in both points scored and points allowed, and his their pass vs run ratio is about the same as when he was with the Steelers-60/40.
4-Who cares?
5-How do we know Coonley isn't lying? He's the one that said Freddy Sanchez was the next Ted Williams.
6-Sounds about right.
7-See #4.
8-Don't need an omen to know we are not going to make the playoffs. Too many injuries, RB by committee that failed, etc.
9-Thank goodness Jones already lost his arbitration...whew!
10-See #'s 4 & 7.
11-No surprise there.
12-Shame if you're right about Karstens. Always liked his coolness under pressure. Never know which Charlie Morton is goiong to show up. And Sanchez, well, another dumpster diving product we're stuck with. Best management team in sports, eh?
13 & 14-Again, who cares.
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written by Steelcity, November 29, 2012 - 07:08 AM
written by Steelcity, November 29, 2012 - 07:08 AM
BR should not play this week even if the doctors give the go ahead. Give Batch another chance to prove himself and see where it takes us. If the Steelers lose against Baltimore then you can have BR start the next game but if they should win against Baltimore, then you go with Batch again. I'm afraid Leftwich should not start again unless Batch gets injured.
As for Arians winning coach of the year I would have to disagree. The motivation for the Colts doing so well this year is due to wanting to honor Chuck Pagano and not Arians. If it were not for Pagano's illness I wonder if the Colt's would play just as hard (with purpose)for Arians- we will never know.
I would choose the coach of the year to go to Schiano of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers.
As for Arians winning coach of the year I would have to disagree. The motivation for the Colts doing so well this year is due to wanting to honor Chuck Pagano and not Arians. If it were not for Pagano's illness I wonder if the Colt's would play just as hard (with purpose)for Arians- we will never know.
I would choose the coach of the year to go to Schiano of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers.
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written by Sharky, November 29, 2012 - 07:15 AM
I predicted the Steelers going 8-8. I also mentioned that since Heinz field opened, the Steelers miss the playoffs every 3rd year with this being the 3rd year.
written by Sharky, November 29, 2012 - 07:15 AM
I predicted the Steelers going 8-8. I also mentioned that since Heinz field opened, the Steelers miss the playoffs every 3rd year with this being the 3rd year.
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written by SteelerMark, November 29, 2012 - 07:15 AM
written by SteelerMark, November 29, 2012 - 07:15 AM
I don't know about BA, but Chuck Pagano as coach of the year maybe?
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written by Rbilak, November 29, 2012 - 07:17 AM
written by Rbilak, November 29, 2012 - 07:17 AM
I would not play Ben this week, if Beachum is starting, he could get killed. The division is not winnable, go for wild card, get healthy. The other concern is can Troy stay healthy for an entire game?
As for the Pirates, Martin offer only shows how big a mistake not taking Weiters has been compounded by Barajas last year, his numbers are concerning. Also let's see if Karstens in non-tendered to free up money, if that is the case, it is simply hurting one position to weaken another, Huntington's M.O.
As for attendance increase, people can spend on what they want, wonder how they will feel when they are out of contention by Memorial Day. That is my prediction.
I am happy for Arians, he never whined about what happened, even when the false retirement statement was done by the Steelers.
As for the Pirates, Martin offer only shows how big a mistake not taking Weiters has been compounded by Barajas last year, his numbers are concerning. Also let's see if Karstens in non-tendered to free up money, if that is the case, it is simply hurting one position to weaken another, Huntington's M.O.
As for attendance increase, people can spend on what they want, wonder how they will feel when they are out of contention by Memorial Day. That is my prediction.
I am happy for Arians, he never whined about what happened, even when the false retirement statement was done by the Steelers.
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written by Darkhorses, November 29, 2012 - 07:18 AM
written by Darkhorses, November 29, 2012 - 07:18 AM
If Pittsburgh competes with NY for Martin, NY has acouple of intangibles going for it. Martin is currently dating a madel/actress and previously dated Alyssa Milano from his LA days. The Burgh may not be his cup of tea
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written by IronCityDrinker, November 29, 2012 - 07:21 AM
written by IronCityDrinker, November 29, 2012 - 07:21 AM
Good Idea playing Ben. If one believes he is a 100 percent healthly, one is a fool. And when he is hit with a cheapshot by one of the dirtiest teams in the League and is lost for more than this season, all of you who believe he should play, should be ashamed. Fact is, people who thought the Steelers were "Set" at backup QB's were made fools of. And now they want ben to save the season. Admit you were wrong and that the Steelers failed to have a solution at backup QB.
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written by jayh63, November 29, 2012 - 07:24 AM
written by jayh63, November 29, 2012 - 07:24 AM
*t will be interesting to see how the courts rule on the Maryland exit fee. If a school votes against it (as Maryland and Florida State did) and then votes to leave the conference within six months after the exit fee vote, can the conference force the new fee on them? Or will the courts allow Maryland to pay the old fee which was much less?
It seems to me that if a conference approves a high exit fee that they also have to give the schools in that conference a reasonable amount of time to seek a new conference before the new fee kicks in. How the courts rule will have major implications for schools like Florida State and Clemson. If Maryland can get out of the 50 million fee, those schools might consider the SEC or Big 12. But if the courts rule in favor of the ACC, I don't think you will see anyone else leaving the ACC for a long time.
Regardless, the ACC will be without a doubt the best basketball conference in the country once Pitt, Syracuse and Louisville joins.
It seems to me that if a conference approves a high exit fee that they also have to give the schools in that conference a reasonable amount of time to seek a new conference before the new fee kicks in. How the courts rule will have major implications for schools like Florida State and Clemson. If Maryland can get out of the 50 million fee, those schools might consider the SEC or Big 12. But if the courts rule in favor of the ACC, I don't think you will see anyone else leaving the ACC for a long time.
Regardless, the ACC will be without a doubt the best basketball conference in the country once Pitt, Syracuse and Louisville joins.
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written by jayh63, November 29, 2012 - 07:37 AM
written by jayh63, November 29, 2012 - 07:37 AM
With the division gone, the Baltimore game is no more important than the San Diego game. In fact, the most important game on the remaining schedule is Cincy, which might be like a playoff game with the winner making the playoffs and the loser being left out. Therefore I would not play any player who is nursing an injury against Baltimore. I would not play Ben, Brown or Troy unless they are close to being 100%.
I still maintain that if Pittsburgh beats Cincy, 9-7 will get them in the playoffs. So all they need to do is win their final 3 home games against SD, Cincy and the Browns. If they can't do that, they don't deserve the playoffs. It's true the Steelers have lost to the Raiders and Titans with Ben but those games were on the road. The Steelers with Ben at QB have only lost 1 home game the past two seasons. If Ben can come back for the SD game, I like the Steelers chances to make the playoffs. No need to play Ben against Baltimore. Even if he is 50/50 as we hear, one more week of sitting out can only help him.
I still maintain that if Pittsburgh beats Cincy, 9-7 will get them in the playoffs. So all they need to do is win their final 3 home games against SD, Cincy and the Browns. If they can't do that, they don't deserve the playoffs. It's true the Steelers have lost to the Raiders and Titans with Ben but those games were on the road. The Steelers with Ben at QB have only lost 1 home game the past two seasons. If Ben can come back for the SD game, I like the Steelers chances to make the playoffs. No need to play Ben against Baltimore. Even if he is 50/50 as we hear, one more week of sitting out can only help him.
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written by richard, November 29, 2012 - 07:44 AM
written by richard, November 29, 2012 - 07:44 AM
1. Tread carefully
2. If he throws out more than six of 93 runners I'm o.k. with the signing.
3. Andrew Luck has a little to do with the turnaround in Indy too.
4. College sports has become a joke.
5. Great...the Nuttings continue to profit and the team will stink again.
6. The most important words in those three sentences-for what their worth. They are worth nothing.
7. Good point but the quarterback always gets the bulk of the blame when a team loses.
8. Well it could be one of those years.
9. It's been nice knowing you GI Jones.
10. Like Nascar the Penguins played their Super Bowl to open the season.
11. Who cares?
12. Not tendering Karstens is a bad move. So chances are the Pirates won't tender Karstens.
13. That non conference schedule is a joke. Pitt should be embarrassed.
14. The other teams might be saying the same thing. "The Royals/Red Sox gave up next to nothing to obtain ."
2. If he throws out more than six of 93 runners I'm o.k. with the signing.
3. Andrew Luck has a little to do with the turnaround in Indy too.
4. College sports has become a joke.
5. Great...the Nuttings continue to profit and the team will stink again.
6. The most important words in those three sentences-for what their worth. They are worth nothing.
7. Good point but the quarterback always gets the bulk of the blame when a team loses.
8. Well it could be one of those years.
9. It's been nice knowing you GI Jones.
10. Like Nascar the Penguins played their Super Bowl to open the season.
11. Who cares?
12. Not tendering Karstens is a bad move. So chances are the Pirates won't tender Karstens.
13. That non conference schedule is a joke. Pitt should be embarrassed.
14. The other teams might be saying the same thing. "The Royals/Red Sox gave up next to nothing to obtain ."
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written by hondo, November 29, 2012 - 07:48 AM
Tino doesn't pass the "eye" test. Ray does.
written by hondo, November 29, 2012 - 07:48 AM
Lots of criticism of Pitt quarterback Tino Sunseri for his lack of fourth-quarter heroics. Isn’t Ray Graham the team’s best offensive player? Why isn’t he getting some of the same criticism?Because the QB is the leader of the offense. He has to make it go. If they stack the box and shut down the run, he has to make them back off with his passing.
Tino doesn't pass the "eye" test. Ray does.
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written by Sandman1, November 29, 2012 - 08:13 AM
written by Sandman1, November 29, 2012 - 08:13 AM
Pitt's Steven Adams has been a big disappoitment so far thus is true you can't denie it. I still think he has a good chance to be a really good player but he's not close to that right now.
Look people are saying this because they were saying he was a possible first round draft pick maybe a one and done kid, so people based there opinion on that. The fact is he isn't a first round draft pick in fact right now he wouldn't be drafted at all. What i didn't like is coach Dixon saying that at times fans expect to much when it comes to big men. Look it happens all the time at other schools like Kentucky and NC highly recruited big men come in there great and a year or two there in the NBA. However we get highly touted big men like Dante Taylor and Adams and we expect to much? come on man, when your highly touted you are expected to perform and when you dont such as Taylor and Adams well then i start to think maybe our recruiting evaluation isn't where it needs to be.
Lets hope that this kid just needs more time to grow as a player and if he does will all forget about what we are saying now. Adams can start by playing with a little more energy and fire because right now it looks like he's having a slow jog in the park, pick it up big fella were pulling for ya
Look people are saying this because they were saying he was a possible first round draft pick maybe a one and done kid, so people based there opinion on that. The fact is he isn't a first round draft pick in fact right now he wouldn't be drafted at all. What i didn't like is coach Dixon saying that at times fans expect to much when it comes to big men. Look it happens all the time at other schools like Kentucky and NC highly recruited big men come in there great and a year or two there in the NBA. However we get highly touted big men like Dante Taylor and Adams and we expect to much? come on man, when your highly touted you are expected to perform and when you dont such as Taylor and Adams well then i start to think maybe our recruiting evaluation isn't where it needs to be.
Lets hope that this kid just needs more time to grow as a player and if he does will all forget about what we are saying now. Adams can start by playing with a little more energy and fire because right now it looks like he's having a slow jog in the park, pick it up big fella were pulling for ya
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written by maz01, November 29, 2012 - 08:23 AM
written by maz01, November 29, 2012 - 08:23 AM
Bob,
The Pirates gave up Gorkys Hernandez for Gabby Sanchez, How is that too much to non tender Gabby?
I believe Miami also received the Pirates 2013 compensation draft pick, which will be, roughly the 32nd of the 2013 draft. -- Bob Smizik
The Pirates gave up Gorkys Hernandez for Gabby Sanchez, How is that too much to non tender Gabby?
I believe Miami also received the Pirates 2013 compensation draft pick, which will be, roughly the 32nd of the 2013 draft. -- Bob Smizik
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written by sms, November 29, 2012 - 08:36 AM
written by sms, November 29, 2012 - 08:36 AM
is marketing genius to use roman numerals to represent the losing seasons - gives it a sense of class and mystery....after all xx1 looks less threatening than 21....
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written by Vinqtin, November 29, 2012 - 08:51 AM
written by Vinqtin, November 29, 2012 - 08:51 AM
RE: Adams. He came from New Zealand, not exactly a hoops Mecca. He's still adjusting to the jump in competition and athleticism. No one can deny that he physically has as much upside as any big man in the country. That is why he was highly touted. We are all probably lucky that he isn't fully developed or he would be gone next year when Pitt has a much better chance of making a run. And, with Dixon's track record of developing big men (Gray, McGhee, Zanna), I think that Adams could be dominant in a year ot two.
I am well aware of Adams' background. Nevertheless, considering his resume, his play thus far has been disappointing -- in fact, extremely disappointing. -- Bob Smizik
I am well aware of Adams' background. Nevertheless, considering his resume, his play thus far has been disappointing -- in fact, extremely disappointing. -- Bob Smizik
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written by Dobreshunka, November 29, 2012 - 09:14 AM
written by Dobreshunka, November 29, 2012 - 09:14 AM
In one breath we're discussing all the unfair criticism that's been heaped upon Sunseri, Pitt starting QB for the last three years, leader of the team.
In the next we're discussing how Pitt only scored 17 points against the Youngstown State Penguins while four teams no one has ever heard of scored anywhere rom 35 to 48 points against the mighty Penguins.
For the life of me, I'll never understand why anyone could possibly think it's "unfair" to criticize the substandard performance of Tino Sunseri, Quarterback, Pittsburgh Panthers.
Another person who thinks the offense is comprised of the QB and no one else.
Sunseri completed 19 of 30 that day for 239 yards, one TD and no interceptions. -- Bob Smizik
In the next we're discussing how Pitt only scored 17 points against the Youngstown State Penguins while four teams no one has ever heard of scored anywhere rom 35 to 48 points against the mighty Penguins.
For the life of me, I'll never understand why anyone could possibly think it's "unfair" to criticize the substandard performance of Tino Sunseri, Quarterback, Pittsburgh Panthers.
Another person who thinks the offense is comprised of the QB and no one else.
Sunseri completed 19 of 30 that day for 239 yards, one TD and no interceptions. -- Bob Smizik
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written by Richard Bipolarman Jarzynka, November 29, 2012 - 09:20 AM
I long ago accepted low payrolls, but I must say . . . A fan who complains that the Pirates don't spend enough can also legitimately complain if the team spends exorbitantly on a player who isn't worth the money.
If a fan demands that payroll be increased to $75 million, he doesn't have to praise the Pirates if they get there by giving Jason Bay $21 million for 2013.
I'm on the fence about whether Russell Martin is worth 3yrs./$25M. I'd rather see that money spent on a starting pitcher, but Martin is a legitimate major league starting catcher and it is a position of great need.
written by Richard Bipolarman Jarzynka, November 29, 2012 - 09:20 AM
I long ago accepted low payrolls, but I must say . . . A fan who complains that the Pirates don't spend enough can also legitimately complain if the team spends exorbitantly on a player who isn't worth the money.
If a fan demands that payroll be increased to $75 million, he doesn't have to praise the Pirates if they get there by giving Jason Bay $21 million for 2013.
I'm on the fence about whether Russell Martin is worth 3yrs./$25M. I'd rather see that money spent on a starting pitcher, but Martin is a legitimate major league starting catcher and it is a position of great need.
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written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 09:21 AM
written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 09:21 AM
HBS,
--You always have to parse Coonelly's words very carefully. When everything was said and done, I don't think the Pirates sold more Full Season equivalent season tickets last year and I don't think they will this year. A "season ticket" can be as little as a six game package
A season ticket of fewer than 81 dates would be a partial season ticket. A combination of partial plans that equals 81 games is a full-season equivalent or an FSE.
You can't fudge those numbers. MLB would be quite upset.
--You always have to parse Coonelly's words very carefully. When everything was said and done, I don't think the Pirates sold more Full Season equivalent season tickets last year and I don't think they will this year. A "season ticket" can be as little as a six game package
A season ticket of fewer than 81 dates would be a partial season ticket. A combination of partial plans that equals 81 games is a full-season equivalent or an FSE.
You can't fudge those numbers. MLB would be quite upset.
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written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 09:31 AM
written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 09:31 AM
Dobreshunka,
For the life of me, I'll never understand why anyone could possibly think it's "unfair" to criticize the substandard performance of Tino Sunseri, Quarterback, Pittsburgh Panthers.
Criticism is one thing but the incessant and at times brutal attacks on a 23-year-old college kid are IMO not only unfair but pathetic.
Particularly when the kid went through several coaching staffs in his Pitt career and put up some very impressive numbers this season.
For the life of me, I'll never understand why anyone could possibly think it's "unfair" to criticize the substandard performance of Tino Sunseri, Quarterback, Pittsburgh Panthers.
Criticism is one thing but the incessant and at times brutal attacks on a 23-year-old college kid are IMO not only unfair but pathetic.
Particularly when the kid went through several coaching staffs in his Pitt career and put up some very impressive numbers this season.
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written by Dobreshunka, November 29, 2012 - 09:32 AM
written by Dobreshunka, November 29, 2012 - 09:32 AM
Bob or anyone else -
How did the QBs for North Dakota State, South Dakota State, Illinois State, and Southern Illinois do against the Youngstown State Penguins? What were their stats? Better or Worse than Sunseri?
How did the QBs for North Dakota State, South Dakota State, Illinois State, and Southern Illinois do against the Youngstown State Penguins? What were their stats? Better or Worse than Sunseri?
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written by NMR, November 29, 2012 - 09:34 AM
written by NMR, November 29, 2012 - 09:34 AM
@Darkhorses - I wonder if the Eat 'n Park girl is single?
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written by BUCCS72, November 29, 2012 - 09:35 AM
written by BUCCS72, November 29, 2012 - 09:35 AM
RBJ....I have also accepted the fact that the Pirates will always have a "low" payroll....and I also accept that their revenues is in the bottom third of MLB...even though their profits are probably in the upper third of MLB...so be it...
But..."low payroll" is a relative term. I suppose you are OK with the Pirates "low" payroll being in the bottom five and in a bad year bottom two or three??? Well...I AM NOT....
A low payroll to me is somewhere south of the MLB average....and the Pirates are ALWAYS WELL BELOW THE MLB AVERAGE and as long as Bob Nutting owns the team will ALWAYS REMAIN below the MLB payroll average.
Combine the ULTRA "low" payroll with poor talent evaluation and misguided payroll spending and oila!.....Numero XXI is on tap!
But..."low payroll" is a relative term. I suppose you are OK with the Pirates "low" payroll being in the bottom five and in a bad year bottom two or three??? Well...I AM NOT....
A low payroll to me is somewhere south of the MLB average....and the Pirates are ALWAYS WELL BELOW THE MLB AVERAGE and as long as Bob Nutting owns the team will ALWAYS REMAIN below the MLB payroll average.
Combine the ULTRA "low" payroll with poor talent evaluation and misguided payroll spending and oila!.....Numero XXI is on tap!
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written by bpn8pitt, November 29, 2012 - 09:38 AM
Believe it or not, there are other catchers out there besides Russell Martin, Rod Barajas, Mike Mckenry and Tony Sanchez.
It bears repeating. The Yankees can get away with paying Martin 8 million dollars to hit .211. The Pirates cannot. And once again, Martin threw out only 7 more runners than Mckenry did last year. It would not take much money to replace Barajas's 6%.
You right, it probably wont happen but if it does, it will be absolute waste of assets.
written by bpn8pitt, November 29, 2012 - 09:38 AM
Believe it or not, there are other catchers out there besides Russell Martin, Rod Barajas, Mike Mckenry and Tony Sanchez.
It bears repeating. The Yankees can get away with paying Martin 8 million dollars to hit .211. The Pirates cannot. And once again, Martin threw out only 7 more runners than Mckenry did last year. It would not take much money to replace Barajas's 6%.
You right, it probably wont happen but if it does, it will be absolute waste of assets.
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written by Jack, November 29, 2012 - 09:41 AM
written by Jack, November 29, 2012 - 09:41 AM
*t's obvious that Ben's injury - while bad- wasn't as serious as he first made it out to be. If it was, the team doctors wouldn't even be considering letting him play yet.
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written by heartbeatsings, November 29, 2012 - 09:41 AM
@better days: Very true, but we aren't talking about what the Pirates report to MLB or, even, reality. We are talking about what Coonelly is saying to the press and the fans.
There are lies, damn lies, statistics and Coonelly interviews.
written by heartbeatsings, November 29, 2012 - 09:41 AM
A season ticket of fewer than 81 dates would be a partial season ticket. A combination of partial plans that equals 81 games is a full-season equivalent or an FSE.
You can't fudge those numbers. MLB would be quite upset.
@better days: Very true, but we aren't talking about what the Pirates report to MLB or, even, reality. We are talking about what Coonelly is saying to the press and the fans.
There are lies, damn lies, statistics and Coonelly interviews.
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written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 09:50 AM
written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 09:50 AM
HBS,
Fair enough. Which takes us to Bob's most recent post. You'll love it.
Thanks.
Fair enough. Which takes us to Bob's most recent post. You'll love it.
Thanks.
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written by hondo, November 29, 2012 - 09:52 AM
written by hondo, November 29, 2012 - 09:52 AM
Bob, you really need to give up this incessant desire to defend the great Tino Sunseri. I have no ill will towards him, but watching him is a frustrating experience. As I said above, he just does not pass the eye test as a decent QB. His best games consist of simply managing the offense and not making too many mistakes. That's his ceiling. He can't avoid pressure, can't make clutch plays when really needed, can't ever single-handedly rally the team to victory, etc.
I heard on the radio the other day in his relatively long tenure as starting QB at Pitt Tino has never led them to a win in a game in which they trailed at the half or fell behind in the second half. Never. He has, however, presided over many a game where the opposite happened. Not all his fault, but he isn't good enough for a major D1 program.
I'm sure nezt year if Pitt's new QB has any struggles, as they surely will, you will be on here beating the drum about how we now miss Tino. That misses the point entirely.
Methinks you are going in with a preconceived idea. He threw 18 TDs, 2 INTs and was 21st in the country in passer rating. He was 13th in yards per attempt. I'm not quite sure how you would find that a ''frustrating experience.''
An offense is more than a QB.
No one ever suggested he is Dan Marino.
Your suggestion that he is `presiding' over games in which the opposition comes back to win is bizarre! You do realize that the opponents coming back usually, not always, rests with the defense. -- Bob Smizik
I heard on the radio the other day in his relatively long tenure as starting QB at Pitt Tino has never led them to a win in a game in which they trailed at the half or fell behind in the second half. Never. He has, however, presided over many a game where the opposite happened. Not all his fault, but he isn't good enough for a major D1 program.
I'm sure nezt year if Pitt's new QB has any struggles, as they surely will, you will be on here beating the drum about how we now miss Tino. That misses the point entirely.
Methinks you are going in with a preconceived idea. He threw 18 TDs, 2 INTs and was 21st in the country in passer rating. He was 13th in yards per attempt. I'm not quite sure how you would find that a ''frustrating experience.''
An offense is more than a QB.
No one ever suggested he is Dan Marino.
Your suggestion that he is `presiding' over games in which the opposition comes back to win is bizarre! You do realize that the opponents coming back usually, not always, rests with the defense. -- Bob Smizik
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written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 09:56 AM
written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 09:56 AM
Dobreshunka,
Here you go. I didn't look at all of them but it seems that Sunseri had a nice game against them.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/2754/youngstown-state-penguins
Here you go. I didn't look at all of them but it seems that Sunseri had a nice game against them.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/2754/youngstown-state-penguins
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written by BayouHoward, November 29, 2012 - 10:01 AM
written by BayouHoward, November 29, 2012 - 10:01 AM
Louisville joining the ACC, and the continuing realignment of universities to different conferences, reminds me of how fortunate Pitt was to be admitted to the ACC.
It is not hard to imagine Pitt not having found a seat in this game of musical chairs. Pitt leadership is to be commended for getting into the ACC.
Howard: Are you including Steve Pederson among the leadership that's to be commended?
-- Bob Smizik
It is not hard to imagine Pitt not having found a seat in this game of musical chairs. Pitt leadership is to be commended for getting into the ACC.
Howard: Are you including Steve Pederson among the leadership that's to be commended?
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written by Miami, November 29, 2012 - 10:08 AM
The Pirates should keep Jones. However he is 31 and I don't think we can expect many more .800+ OPS seasons from him.
written by Miami, November 29, 2012 - 10:08 AM
Atlanta signed free-agent outfielder B.J. Upton to a five-year, $75 million contract yesterday. His OPS each of the past four seasons beginning in 2009: .686, .747, .760, .752. Garrett Jones’ OPS over the same years: .939, .720, .754 .833.
The Pirates should keep Jones. However he is 31 and I don't think we can expect many more .800+ OPS seasons from him.
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written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 10:12 AM
written by better days coming, November 29, 2012 - 10:12 AM
BUCCS,
A low payroll to me is somewhere south of the MLB average....and the Pirates are ALWAYS WELL BELOW THE MLB AVERAGE and as long as Bob Nutting owns the team will ALWAYS REMAIN below the MLB payroll average.
I don't think you can use the average payroll as your bar since the average is skewed upward by the Yankees, Phils, Angels, etc. spending north of $150 MM. The better measuring stick would be the median which is right around $80 MM.
That said IMO both of those are irrelevant given that payroll should be proportionate to revenue. Expecting the Pirates, or the Rays, A's or Royals for that matter, to commit to some mythical payroll number is ridiculous if they don't have the dollars to support it.
A low payroll to me is somewhere south of the MLB average....and the Pirates are ALWAYS WELL BELOW THE MLB AVERAGE and as long as Bob Nutting owns the team will ALWAYS REMAIN below the MLB payroll average.
I don't think you can use the average payroll as your bar since the average is skewed upward by the Yankees, Phils, Angels, etc. spending north of $150 MM. The better measuring stick would be the median which is right around $80 MM.
That said IMO both of those are irrelevant given that payroll should be proportionate to revenue. Expecting the Pirates, or the Rays, A's or Royals for that matter, to commit to some mythical payroll number is ridiculous if they don't have the dollars to support it.
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written by STATONJM, November 29, 2012 - 10:19 AM
written by STATONJM, November 29, 2012 - 10:19 AM
* Now that Ben Roethlisberger is practicing on a limited basis his availability for the game Sunday at Baltimore will be a much-discussed subject this week. Really, though, it’s simple: If the doctors say he can play, he should play. @Smizik
The doctors said Roethlisberger could play on a bad ankle against the 49ers last year. Not only did they lose the game, Ben could not protect himself. The Steelers ran the risk of permanent injury for one stupid game.
This is professional football. It is not billiards. Bradshaw was cleared to play in 1983. He blew out his elbow and never played again.
We are talking about Ben's career here. One stupid game (or season) is not worth risking his career. His throwing shoulder has been seriously injured. What if he blows out his shoulder? What if Suggs sacks him and he blows out his shoulder?
Somebody has to use common sense. He should not play until his shoulder is completely healed. Two decades of mediocre football followed the loss of Bradshaw.
Let's not lose another franchise quarterback due to playing with an injured throwing arm.
The doctors said Roethlisberger could play on a bad ankle against the 49ers last year. Not only did they lose the game, Ben could not protect himself. The Steelers ran the risk of permanent injury for one stupid game.
This is professional football. It is not billiards. Bradshaw was cleared to play in 1983. He blew out his elbow and never played again.
We are talking about Ben's career here. One stupid game (or season) is not worth risking his career. His throwing shoulder has been seriously injured. What if he blows out his shoulder? What if Suggs sacks him and he blows out his shoulder?
Somebody has to use common sense. He should not play until his shoulder is completely healed. Two decades of mediocre football followed the loss of Bradshaw.
Let's not lose another franchise quarterback due to playing with an injured throwing arm.
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written by Jack, November 29, 2012 - 10:30 AM
written by Jack, November 29, 2012 - 10:30 AM
Stats don't mean as much if a player can't produce when the game is on the line. What truly sets a player apart is how he performs in the clutch. A loss is a loss. Maybe it isn't fair, but the quarterback will always be held to a different standard. But, at the same time, you have to admire Sunseri for his toughness.
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written by STATONJM, November 29, 2012 - 10:30 AM
written by STATONJM, November 29, 2012 - 10:30 AM
* Judging from sales, it looks like ticket buyers remember the Pirates June-July run more than their August-September collapse. Concerning season-ticket sales, team president Frank Coonelly told the Tribune Review: ``We are pacing significantly ahead of last year’s pace, which was significantly above the previous year’s pace.’’ @Smizik
This is an easy one. No one should be surprised that the Pirates draw well despite losing for 20 years.
The Cubs have been losing forever. Yet instead of losing fans, they have become "lovable losers." The Pirates have now officially joined the list of "lovable losers."
Can you think of a better entertainment experience than PNC park with fire works on a hot summer night?
Also, a family of four can go to a game for less than going to a movie.
This would not be happening at Three Rivers stadium, but PNC park, like Wrigley Field, is the reason the Pirates (and Cubs) continue to draw fans despite being "lovable losers."
This is an easy one. No one should be surprised that the Pirates draw well despite losing for 20 years.
The Cubs have been losing forever. Yet instead of losing fans, they have become "lovable losers." The Pirates have now officially joined the list of "lovable losers."
Can you think of a better entertainment experience than PNC park with fire works on a hot summer night?
Also, a family of four can go to a game for less than going to a movie.
This would not be happening at Three Rivers stadium, but PNC park, like Wrigley Field, is the reason the Pirates (and Cubs) continue to draw fans despite being "lovable losers."
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written by STATONJM, November 29, 2012 - 10:37 AM
written by STATONJM, November 29, 2012 - 10:37 AM
* The Pitt football team scored 17 points in September against Youngstown State, a team that during a four-week, mid-season span gave up 48 points to North Dakota State, 35 to Illinois State, 38 to Southern Illinois and 41 to South Dakota State.
@Smizik
I am not surprised, Pitt historically underachieves. Penn State and West Virginia overachieve.
This is the proper alignment of the stars. No one understands why this is the natural order, but it just is!
It is what it means to be a Pitt fan.
@Smizik
I am not surprised, Pitt historically underachieves. Penn State and West Virginia overachieve.
This is the proper alignment of the stars. No one understands why this is the natural order, but it just is!
It is what it means to be a Pitt fan.
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written by STATONJM, November 29, 2012 - 10:52 AM
written by STATONJM, November 29, 2012 - 10:52 AM
* Pitt center Steven Adams is yet another highly touted freshman who has been disappointing thus far. Coach Jamie Dixon should continue to play Adams with the good chance that he’ll gain some confidence in the upcoming juggernaut of a schedule facing the Panthers -- Detroit, Duquesne, North Florida, Bethune-Cookman, Delaware State and Kennesaw State.
@Smizik
Actually, I am glad he is not as advertised. This Pitt team is deep and does not need a superstar at center.
The reason I am glad is he will not be a one and done player. He will stay as a soph. and perhaps until his junior year. Pitt probably could have gotten to the final four if Blair had stayed one more year.
Adams has potential to be a lottery pick. He just needs to be smart and stay at least 2-3 years. I have watched him and he has game. I saw him block two shots on one possession and hit a nice 10 foot jump shot. He just lacks training. He fouls way too much, and he can be intimidated by other big men.
Dixon must play him because he can't learn on the bench. Also, he will leave the program, as Burch did, if he doesn't get to play.
@Smizik
Actually, I am glad he is not as advertised. This Pitt team is deep and does not need a superstar at center.
The reason I am glad is he will not be a one and done player. He will stay as a soph. and perhaps until his junior year. Pitt probably could have gotten to the final four if Blair had stayed one more year.
Adams has potential to be a lottery pick. He just needs to be smart and stay at least 2-3 years. I have watched him and he has game. I saw him block two shots on one possession and hit a nice 10 foot jump shot. He just lacks training. He fouls way too much, and he can be intimidated by other big men.
Dixon must play him because he can't learn on the bench. Also, he will leave the program, as Burch did, if he doesn't get to play.
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written by Bob in Vegas, November 29, 2012 - 10:57 AM
written by Bob in Vegas, November 29, 2012 - 10:57 AM
Steven Adams has certainly been disappointing. I expected him to be a little more aggressive, even at this stage.
But to say he wouldnt get drafted is nonsense. A couple mock drafts released in the last few days have him going between 13-15 if he chooses to come out. Once again, the NBA drafts on potential, not what you've done. They draft foreign players in the 1st round that they know wont even make it to the USA for a few years. Dick Vitale still doesnt get this and sounds like an idiot when he screams about it every year.
Adams will improve as the year goes on. I think another year would benefit him, but have my doubts he will stay. The NBA can teach offense. Adams shot blocking and ability to run the court make him a 1st rounder now, anything else is gravy.
But to say he wouldnt get drafted is nonsense. A couple mock drafts released in the last few days have him going between 13-15 if he chooses to come out. Once again, the NBA drafts on potential, not what you've done. They draft foreign players in the 1st round that they know wont even make it to the USA for a few years. Dick Vitale still doesnt get this and sounds like an idiot when he screams about it every year.
Adams will improve as the year goes on. I think another year would benefit him, but have my doubts he will stay. The NBA can teach offense. Adams shot blocking and ability to run the court make him a 1st rounder now, anything else is gravy.
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written by jilted32, November 29, 2012 - 11:21 AM
Let us hope that if Roethlisberger does play the doctors are absolutely sure that he can safely take the pounding that the Ravens will dish out. The Ravens know that he is fragile but tough and that he stands around and takes a beating. Ed Reed is going to dole out some vicious hits because he knows his fine will be over turned.
This will be the week the Steelers are finally put out of their misery. They will lose to the Ravens, the Bengals will win vs. San Diego and the playoff teams will be Indy and Cincinnati.
It's not looking good, with Mendenhall and Wallace getting demoted, and they don't care too much, why should they, they haven't cared all year. Plus the O line getting shuffled around again.
The Steelers should have listened to me and traded Roethlisberger and Polamalu and Mendenhall and Wallace in order to obtain Manning or Luck.
written by jilted32, November 29, 2012 - 11:21 AM
Let us hope that if Roethlisberger does play the doctors are absolutely sure that he can safely take the pounding that the Ravens will dish out. The Ravens know that he is fragile but tough and that he stands around and takes a beating. Ed Reed is going to dole out some vicious hits because he knows his fine will be over turned.
This will be the week the Steelers are finally put out of their misery. They will lose to the Ravens, the Bengals will win vs. San Diego and the playoff teams will be Indy and Cincinnati.
It's not looking good, with Mendenhall and Wallace getting demoted, and they don't care too much, why should they, they haven't cared all year. Plus the O line getting shuffled around again.
The Steelers should have listened to me and traded Roethlisberger and Polamalu and Mendenhall and Wallace in order to obtain Manning or Luck.
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written by Daquido_Bazzini, November 29, 2012 - 11:30 AM
written by Daquido_Bazzini, November 29, 2012 - 11:30 AM
I don't expect to see Ben Roethlisberger for at least another week.
There's no sense in rushing your franchise QB for a team that has quite a few holes in it, and is loaded with injuries.
It's hard to swallow in November....But with the right moves and a healthy Ben Roethlisberger....The Steelers could easily return to prominence next season.
I pretty much count on it....
There's no sense in rushing your franchise QB for a team that has quite a few holes in it, and is loaded with injuries.
It's hard to swallow in November....But with the right moves and a healthy Ben Roethlisberger....The Steelers could easily return to prominence next season.
I pretty much count on it....
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written by apm74, November 29, 2012 - 11:40 AM
If you understood much about the game of college basketball, perhaps your expectations of him would be more realistic. Of course, as a Penn State or WVU apologist, I understand your intent was rather to denigrate Pitt's schedule and a Pitt athlete, regardless of expectations.
If anyone expected Adams to be the second coming of Anthony Davis, then yes, it's unfortunate that he won't live up to those expectations this early. Then again, Adams wasn't as highly touted as Davis. Nor was he considered to be as good as current high profile freshmen, Shabazz Muhammad or Nerlens Noel (even though he outplayed Noel in the 2012 Babc Prep Holiday Tournament). And those two have also had their struggles this season.
If you were expecting Adams to come in and be a dominant force right away, I'd argue that notion is a bit naive. Fundamentally he plays a position that requires tremendous physicality, especially in Jamie Dixon's scheme. Yet he's only 19 years old and is only about half-way through his first year of Pitt's conditioning program. He's not a guard or small forward, where a player can sometimes rely on athleticism in lieu of shortcomings in terms of strength.
I agree with Bob in Vegas, he will get better (and stronger) as the year goes on. It'll be great for Pitt if he comes back for another year. But professional basketball operates in a completely different context than the NFL, so unfortunately there's a chance that Pitt may not be a beneficiary of much of his potential. If he stays, next year's Pitt team could be really good.
written by apm74, November 29, 2012 - 11:40 AM
written by DaveK, November 29, 2012 - 02:57 AM
Adams is a disappointment thus far. That is reality. Being a Pitt apologist doesn't chane that. You can put quotes around it all you want. He was highly touted. And he hasn't lived up to expectations yet. Period. Its not saying he never will, but its just as likely (probably way more) he won't than it is he will.
Sugar coating it doesn;t make it different than what it really is, unless you have one heck of an imagination.
If you understood much about the game of college basketball, perhaps your expectations of him would be more realistic. Of course, as a Penn State or WVU apologist, I understand your intent was rather to denigrate Pitt's schedule and a Pitt athlete, regardless of expectations.
If anyone expected Adams to be the second coming of Anthony Davis, then yes, it's unfortunate that he won't live up to those expectations this early. Then again, Adams wasn't as highly touted as Davis. Nor was he considered to be as good as current high profile freshmen, Shabazz Muhammad or Nerlens Noel (even though he outplayed Noel in the 2012 Babc Prep Holiday Tournament). And those two have also had their struggles this season.
If you were expecting Adams to come in and be a dominant force right away, I'd argue that notion is a bit naive. Fundamentally he plays a position that requires tremendous physicality, especially in Jamie Dixon's scheme. Yet he's only 19 years old and is only about half-way through his first year of Pitt's conditioning program. He's not a guard or small forward, where a player can sometimes rely on athleticism in lieu of shortcomings in terms of strength.
I agree with Bob in Vegas, he will get better (and stronger) as the year goes on. It'll be great for Pitt if he comes back for another year. But professional basketball operates in a completely different context than the NFL, so unfortunately there's a chance that Pitt may not be a beneficiary of much of his potential. If he stays, next year's Pitt team could be really good.
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written by Woomer, November 29, 2012 - 12:57 PM
I don't agree that choosing a combination of:
AVG and OBP and SLG and OPS and HRs
as a group of representative offensive stats is cherry picking.
But I'm fine that we can just agree to disagree on that point.
written by Woomer, November 29, 2012 - 12:57 PM
An egregious case of cherrypicking your stats. -- Bob Smizik
I don't agree that choosing a combination of:
AVG and OBP and SLG and OPS and HRs
as a group of representative offensive stats is cherry picking.
But I'm fine that we can just agree to disagree on that point.
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written by Woomer, November 29, 2012 - 01:12 PM
I honestly don't know why so many people are upset about Sunseri.
I mean...really...he's just a college kid, and he seems to be playing well enough to earn his scholarship, right? So I think that's about all you can ask of him.
(And further, I'm sure there are other players on the team -- backups -- that are earning the same scholarship for poorer play.) So what's the big deal?
written by Woomer, November 29, 2012 - 01:12 PM
I honestly don't know why so many people are upset about Sunseri.
I mean...really...he's just a college kid, and he seems to be playing well enough to earn his scholarship, right? So I think that's about all you can ask of him.
(And further, I'm sure there are other players on the team -- backups -- that are earning the same scholarship for poorer play.) So what's the big deal?
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written by foghorn, November 29, 2012 - 02:16 PM
written by foghorn, November 29, 2012 - 02:16 PM
*t would be beyond stupid to play Ben this week. I can't believe anyone would be foolish enough to want him to play.
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written by Hailtopitt81, November 29, 2012 - 02:44 PM
written by Hailtopitt81, November 29, 2012 - 02:44 PM
People complain that Jamie Dixon either doesn't go after, or isn't able to get the top caliber recruits. Now he's got one and people are unhappy that he's not setting the world on fire every game. For the love of god, it's been 7 games. Let the kid play and develop. By my eye, the end result is going to be worth it.
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written by bpn8pitt, November 29, 2012 - 02:48 PM
Hailtopitt81
I agree. People wanted Dante Taylor, Khem Birch, and Steve Adams. Got to take the downs with the ups. Like you said 7 games, please...Im pretty sure Krauser and Knight were raw 7 games in.
written by bpn8pitt, November 29, 2012 - 02:48 PM
Hailtopitt81
I agree. People wanted Dante Taylor, Khem Birch, and Steve Adams. Got to take the downs with the ups. Like you said 7 games, please...Im pretty sure Krauser and Knight were raw 7 games in.
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written by BUCCS72, November 29, 2012 - 03:49 PM
written by BUCCS72, November 29, 2012 - 03:49 PM
BDC'g.....admittedly, I mistakenly signed up for a Statistics class in college and dropped it the first week... but the difference between the MLB average and "median" is???? Both figures would factor in every MLB team....right???
And as I wrote on another thread yesterday....phooey on the MLB average payroll anyway...the problem is the Pirates won't even spend anywhere near the level of the Brewers and Reds....both similar/smaller markets within their division.....regardless of what the MLB average....er....median is....
Any way you slice it or dice it....the Pirates ownership is just a risk-averse cheapskate.
And as I wrote on another thread yesterday....phooey on the MLB average payroll anyway...the problem is the Pirates won't even spend anywhere near the level of the Brewers and Reds....both similar/smaller markets within their division.....regardless of what the MLB average....er....median is....
Any way you slice it or dice it....the Pirates ownership is just a risk-averse cheapskate.
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written by BiC, November 29, 2012 - 03:56 PM
Pierzynski had 77 RBIs and a .278 average. Martin had 53 and .211. Those are not remarkably similar numbers. Martin draws walks, though, which helps his OBP a lot.
Yes there are good arguments in favor of Martin. However, the Pirates need a decent catcher who can hit for average. OBP with a lot of walks isn't good enough as the Pirates have so many guys with downright sorry batting averages it won't make a difference if one or two guys are on when the next one up whiffs.
Will be interesting to see how this pans out.
written by BiC, November 29, 2012 - 03:56 PM
written by dontknocktherock, November 29, 2012 - 05:20 AM
Looking at the 162 game averages for Pierzynski and Martin on baseballreference.com, they are remarkably similar for HR, RBI, and OPS. If Martin is better defensively and at least somebody in MLB likes him (not the case with Pierzynski) and he is six years younger, I believe he's he better choice of the two.
Pierzynski had 77 RBIs and a .278 average. Martin had 53 and .211. Those are not remarkably similar numbers. Martin draws walks, though, which helps his OBP a lot.
Yes there are good arguments in favor of Martin. However, the Pirates need a decent catcher who can hit for average. OBP with a lot of walks isn't good enough as the Pirates have so many guys with downright sorry batting averages it won't make a difference if one or two guys are on when the next one up whiffs.
Will be interesting to see how this pans out.
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written by hiddenvigorish, November 29, 2012 - 04:27 PM
Bob, can you please detail this resume of which you speak and point out exactly why it has created the expectations that it has?
He was and is projected to go high in the NBA draft if he decides to come out. He was one of the more heralded recruits in the country. -- Bob Smizik
written by hiddenvigorish, November 29, 2012 - 04:27 PM
I am well aware of Adams' background. Nevertheless, considering his resume, his play thus far has been disappointing -- in fact, extremely disappointing. -- Bob Smizik
Bob, can you please detail this resume of which you speak and point out exactly why it has created the expectations that it has?
He was and is projected to go high in the NBA draft if he decides to come out. He was one of the more heralded recruits in the country. -- Bob Smizik
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written by Dobreshunka, November 29, 2012 - 06:11 PM
written by Dobreshunka, November 29, 2012 - 06:11 PM
"An offense is more than a quarterback." Bob Smizik
Tell that to the 2011 Indianapolis Colts.
Tell that to the 2011 Indianapolis Colts.
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written by Dobreshunka, November 29, 2012 - 06:42 PM
written by Dobreshunka, November 29, 2012 - 06:42 PM
Got my stats, thanks Better Days Coming
Ahem,
Let me begin by reminding everyone Pitt had never lost to a Div II team until the Youngstown State game this year with Tino Sunseri at QB.
Here's how other Div II QBs fared against Youngstown State Penguins:
ND State, QB Jensen, 15/23, 200 yds , 2 TDs, 0 int
Illinois St, QB Brown, 20/31, 225 yds, 3 TDs, 0 int
SIU, QB Faulkner, 20/30, 185 yds, 2 TDs, 0 int
SD State, QB Sumner, 19/28, 351 yds, 5 TDs, 1 int
Sunseri, 19/30, 239 yds, 1 TD, 0 int
Conclusion - Sunseri would have a shot at starting at the four Div II schools listed. Sunseri's stats would be considered "good" IF he were a Div II QB.
Good stats for a Div I QB against a wretched Div II team like Youngstown State should be at least 25/30, 350-400 yds passing and anywhere from 3-5 TD passes. How can anyone in their right mind brag about how "good" Sunseri's stats were that fateful day?
Ahem,
Let me begin by reminding everyone Pitt had never lost to a Div II team until the Youngstown State game this year with Tino Sunseri at QB.
Here's how other Div II QBs fared against Youngstown State Penguins:
ND State, QB Jensen, 15/23, 200 yds , 2 TDs, 0 int
Illinois St, QB Brown, 20/31, 225 yds, 3 TDs, 0 int
SIU, QB Faulkner, 20/30, 185 yds, 2 TDs, 0 int
SD State, QB Sumner, 19/28, 351 yds, 5 TDs, 1 int
Sunseri, 19/30, 239 yds, 1 TD, 0 int
Conclusion - Sunseri would have a shot at starting at the four Div II schools listed. Sunseri's stats would be considered "good" IF he were a Div II QB.
Good stats for a Div I QB against a wretched Div II team like Youngstown State should be at least 25/30, 350-400 yds passing and anywhere from 3-5 TD passes. How can anyone in their right mind brag about how "good" Sunseri's stats were that fateful day?
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written by FantasyTom, November 29, 2012 - 09:29 PM
Oh yeah, three and out, three and out, fumble the snap at crucial times, three and out numerous times when all that was needed was to give the defense a little rest. No -- More three and outs. The quarterback played a big role in our folding at the end of these games.
written by FantasyTom, November 29, 2012 - 09:29 PM
Your suggestion that he is `presiding' over games in which the opposition comes back to win is bizarre! You do realize that the opponents coming back usually, not always, rests with the defense. -- Bob Smizik
Oh yeah, three and out, three and out, fumble the snap at crucial times, three and out numerous times when all that was needed was to give the defense a little rest. No -- More three and outs. The quarterback played a big role in our folding at the end of these games.
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written by FantasyTom, November 29, 2012 - 09:38 PM
written by FantasyTom, November 29, 2012 - 09:38 PM
Forgot to mention all the sacks taken rather than throwing the ball away and sacks that took points off the board as well. This guy was a disaster for Pitt for 4 long years!
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written by hiddenvigorish, November 30, 2012 - 08:56 AM
Sorry Bob, but that's not a resume. The truth is that his resume, as a body of work, is incredibly weak. He didn't start playing ball until he was 14 years old. He played in New Zealand, which has practically no competitive basketball and little capable basketball coaching. It's not even a high school sport there, and is only played as a club sport. It would be like being a budding rugby player here in the states.
The truth is, he played in only two big time 3-day camps, and fared very well there. Upon transferring to a big time prep school in the states for a half season, his numbers were actually fairly pedestrian.
His "resume" is really only comprised of his personal attributes - which are substantial. What you suggest Bob are not things that would be part of a resume, but projections. There is no doubt to Adams' upside given his physical talents. He will be a great player. I don't know where anyone suggested that he'd be a great player in his first year of college ball. To say he's been extremely disappointing is completely unfair, unless you're apt to buy into unrealistic hype - which I didn't think you were apt to do Bob.
written by hiddenvigorish, November 30, 2012 - 08:56 AM
He was and is projected to go high in the NBA draft if he decides to come out. He was one of the more heralded recruits in the country. -- Bob Smizik
Sorry Bob, but that's not a resume. The truth is that his resume, as a body of work, is incredibly weak. He didn't start playing ball until he was 14 years old. He played in New Zealand, which has practically no competitive basketball and little capable basketball coaching. It's not even a high school sport there, and is only played as a club sport. It would be like being a budding rugby player here in the states.
The truth is, he played in only two big time 3-day camps, and fared very well there. Upon transferring to a big time prep school in the states for a half season, his numbers were actually fairly pedestrian.
His "resume" is really only comprised of his personal attributes - which are substantial. What you suggest Bob are not things that would be part of a resume, but projections. There is no doubt to Adams' upside given his physical talents. He will be a great player. I don't know where anyone suggested that he'd be a great player in his first year of college ball. To say he's been extremely disappointing is completely unfair, unless you're apt to buy into unrealistic hype - which I didn't think you were apt to do Bob.
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written by PittandthePendulum, November 30, 2012 - 10:06 AM
written by PittandthePendulum, November 30, 2012 - 10:06 AM
and you actually have to have some offensive plays scripted for Adams in the paint to allow him to show what hes got....if anything.
Ive been to three games and didnt see a single O play designed to get Adams the ball...not one!
Jamie seems to want him to get rebounds and any garbage buckets he can get.
Gotta be more proactive coaching with him than THAT!
Ive been to three games and didnt see a single O play designed to get Adams the ball...not one!
Jamie seems to want him to get rebounds and any garbage buckets he can get.
Gotta be more proactive coaching with him than THAT!
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written by PittandthePendulum, November 30, 2012 - 10:09 AM
written by PittandthePendulum, November 30, 2012 - 10:09 AM
Tino like the current Pitt team is schitzo.
Which one will show up?
On cue, if the game means nothing they will play great...if there actually is something important riding on a winning outcome....will fold like a tissue paper tent.
Sure would like to seem them finally turn the corner and win a game that means something to this program....and hopefully gets them an invite to play WVU in the Holiday Bowl in NYC vs another dumb trip to some duffass bowl...like the Beef O"Brady Bowl in St Petersburg or worse!
Which one will show up?
On cue, if the game means nothing they will play great...if there actually is something important riding on a winning outcome....will fold like a tissue paper tent.
Sure would like to seem them finally turn the corner and win a game that means something to this program....and hopefully gets them an invite to play WVU in the Holiday Bowl in NYC vs another dumb trip to some duffass bowl...like the Beef O"Brady Bowl in St Petersburg or worse!
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I'm sure there are numerous times in the NFL where a player is boarderline and the doctors allow him to play. Ben's ankle injury last year comes to mind. There is no way it was medically "preferable" but they determined it could be done.
With an injury to the throwing shoulder, you don't take that chance.
Yes it will suck if the Steelers miss the playoffs this year but it will be worse if Ben seriously damaages his should and can't play next year either. So I would say they better be as sure as medically possible before green lighting him.
My hunch, we don't see #7 behind center until December 9th.